with James Cahill
In this chat, I caught up with David McCormack from Custard as they gear up for their double album release and tour. We discussed his experiences as a musician, the songwriting process, and the vital role of live shows today. David’s candidness and wit made for an enlightening conversation, so strap yourself in!
James Cahill (BMA): So, Canberra—are you pumped?
David McCormack (McCORMACK): Yeah, I love Canberra.
That said, I never see much of it because we’ve always driven in on the day of the gig, done the sound check, played, and then left the following morning or sometimes even that night.
Which is insane. Next time we play there, I’m staying over for the night.
JAMES (BMA): Do you have any plans for when you’re here next?
McCORMACK: Wing it, just improvise.
Once, we found a pub where you could cook your own steak. It was huge—this big, pink, old place. They just give you the raw meat, and you whack it on the barbie.
Keen to play at The Baso, however. Last time we were there, it was an incredible vibe.
JAMES (BMA): And what kind of vibe do you need to get the best( out of yourself?
McCORMACK: Any vibe. But I prefer The Baso vibe. Coupla beers, relax.
JAMES (BMA): The Baso is good! I played there a couple of weeks ago, and I love the venue.
McCORMACK: You’re an artist, James?
JAMES (BMA): Yeah, just starting out. What advice would you give to emerging artists like me?
McCORMACK: It’s different for everyone. For me, it’s about being open to the people you’re playing with.
When I was younger, I was pretty cocky and thought I knew everything. In my early 20s, I was like: “Play this, do that, stand there.”
But after 10 years of that, I realised other people have great ideas, too, and I love hearing what they bring to the table. I notice this, particularly during recording sessions. There are times when someone plays something unexpected, and at first, it’s not what I envisioned. But after letting it percolate, we listen back a few times, and I realise it’s so much better than anything I would’ve come up with on my own.
JAMES (BMA): And you have to allow that to happen.
McCORMACK: Exactly. You have to allow that to happen. My younger self, James, had so many internal rules—I would’ve been such a pain, back then. Now, I’m just happy we get to play music and record together.
JAMES (BMA): You recorded this album in Tasmania, right?
McCORMACK: Have you heard about the recording studio at MONA? It’s incredible! It has all this great old gear. We recorded on one-inch or half-inch tape—only eight tracks were available. We had three drum tracks, two guitar tracks, a bass, and a guide.
It was really limited, but that made the whole experience great. We just committed to it, you know?
JAMES (BMA): Do you like the restrictions of working with eight tracks?
McCORMACK: Loved it! I loved the restrictions. Sometimes, you go into a studio, and they have 16 mics on the snare and heaps of mics and DIs. We just went in and did 19 songs in two days.
JAMES (BMA): Two days!? That’s insane!
McCORMACK: It WAS insane, but it was good—nothing too complicated. A couple of weeks before that, we got together at drummer Glen Thompson’s house to sit around and take little cheat sheet notes, like: “Okay, this song goes from C to G to F.”
We did have a bit of rehearsal and pre-production, but it worked well. We’ve been playing music together for so long, there’s not much to figure out.
JAMES (BMA): Basically just chatting with each other and candidly recording it?
McCORMACK: Exactly, James; yeah, that’s it. I have a vague idea of what everyone will do, but they always seem to do it better than I thought.
JAMES (BMA): At least it’s better!
McCORMACK: And we weren’t doing vocals; just tracking. It was basic.
I took my songs back to my little bedroom home studio and worked on some parts there, which I found much better than going into a studio. In a studio, it feels like a “performance” because people in the control room—like an engineer—are looking at you through the glass.
At home, I can just be a complete nob. When I’m trying to figure out lyrics and melodies, it’s much better in isolation. In front of people, I get self-conscious and think, “I’m not going to try that because I might look silly.” At home, there’s absolutely no one who will hear it until I’m ready to share it. I can’t do it if someone is in the next room. I just wait until they leave.
JAMES (BMA): What makes it so challenging to be creative when someone else is present?
McCORMACK: I think it’s just human nature, you know.
We don’t want to embarrass ourselves. Even by yourself, it’s hard to let go, isn’t it? Often, I don’t have lyrics or melodies worked out beforehand, so it’s like a fishing expedition tool. Everything starts out like ‘nah, nah, nah, nah, nah… yeah!’. Keep on trying and see what bubbles to the surface.
JAMES (BMA): Speaking of melodies, I’ve had ‘Molecules Colliding’ stuck in my head for the last few days. What do you think makes those melodies so catchy?
McCORMACK: I don’t know, James! It’s a bit like just coming up with stuff without overanalysing. If we can remember the song’s melody, then maybe it’s okay.
I take lots of little notes on my iPhone and things like that. It’s always a positive feeling when you come up with what you think might be the melody and can remember it later on.
JAMES (BMA): I guess that’s similar to your single ‘Someday,’ which you wrote 20 years ago.
McCORMACK: Yeah, it was written while I was at the house of Sarah Longhurst, my manager at the time. She had a friend, Serena Ryder, who had come over from Canada to do some gigs. We were just sitting around, had a couple of glasses of wine, and started strumming our guitars. That’s how we came up with the song.
We quickly recorded it on a cassette or something, and then I completely forgot about it.
A year ago, I remembered the song. So I emailed Serena and said, “I’m going to do it. Would you sing on it?” She was all for it. We sent it over, and it turned out lovely. It’s something we’ve never done on a Custard album before— this co-lead, duet kind of thing.
JAMES (BMA): How do you think the landscape for artists has changed since you started, especially with the rise of streaming?
McCORMACK: It’s different now. Back when we started, every time you sold a physical copy of something, you got money for it. With streaming, you get next to nothing. Artists like us have to embrace live performance because, number one, it’s fun, and number two, you can make a little bit of money from it, unlike streaming.
JAMES (BMA): Yeah. What do you and the rest of the band do outside of Custard?
McCORMACK: Well, everyone has a job. I do music for TV shows. Paul’s in the medical psychology field, and Matthew’s in retail. So we all have other things we do.
For 90% of the year, we come together for a little recording session and do a couple of weekends of gigs at the end of the year. It’s good to have many different irons in the fire so that you have something else to focus on when it gets you down.
JAMES (BMA): What TV shows are you currently working on?
McCORMACK: NCIS Sydney, at the moment. I’m very lucky because I don’t have formal music training, so I’ve just learned ideas from others and tried to teach myself how to do it. So, yeah, it’s good. I’m very lucky to have a job that involves music.
JAMES (BMA): So lucky! It’s inspiring to know that there are paths involving music. Before we go, is there anything else you’d like to add?
McCORMACK: No, not really. Just make stuff up if you need more words!
JAMES (BMA): Roger that! I won’t make it too controversial. I really appreciate the chat, and I can’t wait for the good vibes at The Baso!
McCORMACK: Thanks, James.
Custard hit up their favourite haunt, The Baso, on Friday, 29 November, with super special guests, The Fauves. Tix $60 via Oztix.
Keep up with the latest Custard news here. Maybe pop on over to the Custard Appreciation Society while your there.
